S 4X4 vs. Offroad model differences

[webbtrad]

Having read your great informative posts, I decided to register on the forum and throw out a couple of questions seeking some advice about features/capabilities before I buy an Xterra 4x4. With a large German Shepard, and need to get out of Los Angeles exploring far flung places only accessible to hardy off-roaders, it's time my old Volvo 240 wagon --which went where no mortal two-wheel drive wheel should have gone -- was retired and I take the 4x4 plunge. The second generation Xterra comes up trumps in my research and fits my budget.

Sure there are live axle vehicles out there that are great for their superb articulation. Indeed, the older Jeep Cherokee XJ's appeal and would fill the bill in the capability department. They are cheap to purchase, run forever, and have a lot to offer in the upgrades and economy of repair department, but I just can't get my derrière in the seat and feel comfortable on long hauls. Moreover, too many of the cosmetic details are poorly made and frankly cheap on most of the Jeep models. The later Jeeps -- I got excited about the Commander -- get poor reviews and seems unreliable for the most part. Transmissions seem to fail on a regular basis and consumer reviews often warn against purchasing these vehicles. Toyota's get great reliability ratings, and of course, the older Land cruisers (1994) with double locking diffs seem great but suck gas like a teenager with a 7-Eleven Slurpee. Newer Toyota models --including the 4-runner -- are well out of my budget. I love the look and feel of the Land Rover products but have been warned to run a four minute mile in the opposite direction. Is there a Land Rover dealer close to the Mojave desert? Of course, a Range Rover is not in my future financially anyway.

So, with the help of Edmund's and others, I see that the Xterra gets good all round reviews and with it's tacturian sensibilities gets my vote for the vehicle that will fit my needs. They being primarily: reasonable gas consumption, fair ride on the highway, good off-road prowess, utilitarian interiors, many other practical features, reliability.

Of course, you all know how good your Nissan Xterra vehicles are so, after a less than concise introduction (thanks for reading anyway), my questions:

1 - The Off-road model seems great, but is the 4x4 S as capable?
2 - Are there any transmission, or differential differences (I know the Off-roads come with an electronic locking diff and the S does not)?
3 - How important, or effective, is the locking diff?
4 - Are there any other important 4x4 differences between the two?
5 - What after market lockers are available for the S.
6- Is the under body armor on the Off-road worth it? I see after market armor is available although seemingly heavy?
7 - Does the OR have any other features that make it more worthwhile vs. the S 4X4?

I am leaning towards a used 2007 X 4X4 "S", as some report it has some advantages over other vintages. A 2010 "S" 4x4 seems like a good bet as well, and with mfg incentives they can be near the $20,000 mark. More expensive Off-road models new or used seem hard to find anyway.

Thanks in advance for any advice you can give before I do battle with the Nissan dealer/s.

Paul H

[Phall92139]

I just bought a 2010 Xterra Off Road and did a ton of research before the purchase. That doesn't mean I'm the most qualified guy here to answer your questions but I'll give it a shot.   On this year's models the Off Road offers not only the E-locker but:
  Hill Decent Control (automatic only)
  Hill Start Assist (automatic only)
  Clutch Start/Cancel (manual only)
  32" tires with a little more aggressive tread
  Roof rack mounted Off Road lights
  Skid Plates - oil pan, fuel tank, transfer case

There are a few more amenities but this is essentially the stuff that effects off-road capabilities.

Is the Off Road model more capable off-road than the 'S'?  Right off the showroom floor?  Yes, a little bit.  It has a tad more ground clearance and a rear locker that can mean making a climb up that step or waterfall, or not making it without a strap or winch.  That E-locker can hook you up in the sand or mud to make the difference of getting out or not.  As in my Rubicon, the fault with it I see is that it's relinquished to being used in only 4-low (however, as with most things, that too can be defeated).  As for the skid plates, they are minimal at best and would be something to upgrade for anything but mild  off-roading.

The Off Road model, in my opinion, is looked at as either a good base to start building on, or probably as in my case, pretty much all I'll need for how I plan to wheel it.

If you plan to really build your Xterra into a pretty hardcore rig then the 'S' might be the most economical way to go.  As to what parts are available for your proposed 's,' I'll let others with more knowledge direct you there.

[webbtrad]

Phall92139... Thanks for taking the time to post some great information. My budget is on the lower end, so the "S" may suit better new, but I'll look for a used (hard to find) "Off-road" model as an alternative. The locker is I believe the important factor here. Sandy creek beds and rock ledges will be a problem for me.

Is there anyone who installs air-lockers for the X located in say the San Fernando Valley, or within earshot?

Paul H

[Phall92139]

I mean, yeah, as long as you are not in a screaming hurry you can build an 'S' at your own pace, build it exactly for what you intend to do with it, do it right the 1st time, and come out cheaper than buying an Off Road model and replacing parts you paid for with aftermarket stuff.

I personally like ARB air lockers.  Dependable and trail proved.  Upgrade the standard air line with either braided stainless or a hard line and you've got a pretty bulletproof locker.

I'm not familiar with your area enough to recommend a good shop but some of them within 10 miles of the 9134X zip code are:

JC Fab
22117 Sierra Hwy
 Sylmar CA 91342
818-367-9904
http://www.jcfabanddesign.com/
 Distance: 1 mi.

4 Wheel Parts Performance Center
7640 Sepulveda Blvd.
 Van Nuys CA 91405
818-988-2754
Distance: 5 mi.

TLC
14743 Oxnard
 Van Nuys CA 91411
818-785-2200
http://www.tlc4x4.com
 Distance: 7 mi.

Four X Doctor1033 N. Victory Pl
 Burbank CA 91502
818-845-2194
http://www.fourxdoctor.com/
 Distance: 10 mi.

Viking Off Road
3940 Laurel Canyon Blvd #974
 Studio City CA 91604
818-506-9789
http://www.vikingoffroad.com/
 Distance: 10 mi.

Specter Off Road Inc
21600 Nordhoff
Chatsworth CA 91311
818-882-1238
http://www.sor.com/
 Distance: 10 mi.

 
Keep us posted as to what you do.

Good luck.

[webbtrad]

Phil,

Thanks. Excellent information, and most of the referrals you gave are within my "zone", as I live in the North Hollywood area. Leaning towards the DYI upgrade approach appeals, as opposed to buying the OR model to start.

Paul H

[Phall92139]

Cool.  Glad to help out.  As I said, I'm pretty new to the Xterra but the "build" thought process is pretty much the same regardless of the rig.  My primary off-road rig is an '03 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon that I have invested much time and $$$ into.  I have tried to do it "right," and am happy so far with what's been accomplished.  I began my long list of mods with safety and recovery equipment and it wasn't unitl the rig was 4 years old before I got around to suspension and lift.  Obviously, there's a point where you will never recover the money you've invested into a heavily built vehicle but then again, I plan on being buried in my Jeep so it doesn't matter to me.  The Jeep was my mid-life crisis and passion.  There are lots of other hobbies that can be just as, or more expensive.

Here's my Jeep mod list, not trying to brag (okay, just a bit maybe) but to show just how crazy an investment these things can be:

ENGINE /COOLING/PERFORMANCE
   E-3 Diamond Fire Spark Plugs
   Mac’s Cold Air Induction System
   K&N Secondary Intake Filter
   AMSOIL Ea Primary Cowl Induction Air Filter
   Active Performance 2-Core Aluminum Radiator w/Integral Bottom Skid Plate
   Mr. Gasket Therma-Cap Radiator Cap (16 psi)
   BRX High Performance Silicone Radiator Hoses
   BRX High Performance Silicone Heater Hoses
   Gen-Right Heat Reduction Hood Louvers
   M.O.R.E. Bomb Proof Torsion Rubber Motor Mounts
   Superlift TruSpeed Speed Sensor Calibrator
   Donaldson P550299 2-Qt. Lube Filter
   AMSOIL Signature Series 0W-30 100% Synthetic Motor Oil (SSO)
DRIVETRAIN/AXLES/SHAFTS
   Alloy USA 4.88 Ring & Pinion Set (front differential)
   Alloy USA 4.88 Ring & Pinion Set (rear differential)
   Alloy USA “Chromoly” 30-Spline Front Axle Shaft Kit
   Alloy USA High Strength 30-Spline Rear Axle Kit
   Alloy USA Billet Aluminum Axle Tube Oil Seals
   Tom Wood’s Thick Wall, Long Travel Spline, 1330 CV (double cardan) Driveshaft w/”Gold Seal” U-joints (front)
   JE Reel 1350 CV (double cardan) Canyon Crawler Driveshaft (rear)
   AMSOIL Synthetic Automatic Transmission Fluid (ATF) – 42RLE Trans
   AMSOIL Synthetic Automatic Transmission Fluid (ATF) – NV241OR Transfer Case
SUSPENSION/STEERING
   Nth Degree Mobility 6” Long Arm Gyro Joint Kit
   Nth Degree Mobility Forged Steel WJ Front Trackbar w/Adjustable Brace
   Nth Degree Mobility Rear Spring Location Brackets
   Nth Degree Mobility Shock Shifter (rear)
   Nth Degree Mobility Frequency Tuned Springs (front & rear)
   Nth Degree Mobility Stinger—Center Mounted Torque Arm
   Nth Degree Mobility Custom Off-set Swaybar Endlinks (rear)
   Nth Degree Mobility Quick Silver Swaybar Disconnects (front)
   Nth Degree Mobility Dropped Pitman Arm
   Currectlync™ Heavy Duty Tie Rod & Drag Link Assembly
   AMSOIL Synthetic Universal Power Steering Fluid
TIRES/WHEELS/BRAKES
   Goodyear Wrangler MT/R Kevlar 35x12.50R15 Tires (05ea.)
   Champion Aluminum “Baja” Wheels w/C3 Flush Mount Lock Ring Beadlocks (05ea.)
   EBC Slotted & Dimpled Sport Rotors
   EBC “Red Stuff” Brake Pads (front)
   EBC “Green Stuff” Brake Pads (rear)
   Nth Degree Mobility Extended Stainless Steel Brake Lines (front & rear)
   AMSOIL Series 500 High-Performance DOT 3 Brake Fluid
ELECTRICAL/LIGHTING
   Sears Diehard Platinum AGM Deep-Cycle Battery
   Thermo-Tec Battery Heat Barrier Kit
   Mean Green 200 Amp High Output Alternator
   NAPA ReMan Starter
   G.E. Silverstar High Output Halogen Headlamps
   O.E.M.  Fog Lamps
   Optronics Pro-Burner Series Driving Lights—06ea. (hood mounted)
   K.C. Highlights Halogen Backup Lights
   Roundeyes LED Rock Lights—06ea.
   Chevy 1500 OEM Retractable Under Hood Trouble Light
   Hella Twin SuperTone 118 dB Air Horns
BUMPERS/ARMOR
   ARB Bull Winch Bumper
   Steve McKay Custom Rear Bumper w/Swing-out Tire Carrier
   Nth Degree Mobility Tummy Tucker Center T/C Skid Plate
   Nth Degree Mobility Tummy Tucker Auto Trans Skid Plate
   Nth Degree Mobility Oil Pan Skid Plate
   Nth Degree Mobility Slider Differential & Pinion Skid Plate (front)
   Nth Degree Mobility Slider Differential & Pinion Skid Plate (rear)
   Warn Differential Cover Skid (front)
   Poison Spyder Rock Ring Differential Cover (rear)
   Poison Spyder Ricochet Rockers w/DuraBak Coating
   Kilby Steering Box Skid
   Kilby Gas Tank Skid
   Genuine Steel Head & Tail Light Brush Guards
RECOVERY/SAFETY/AIR
   Steve McKay Custom 6pt. Roll Cage
   60” Hi-Lift Jack
   Tough Stuff Hi-Lift Jack Hood Rack
   Hi-Lift Lift Mate
   JackMate – Lift Jack Companion Tool
   Hi-Lift Off Road Base (ORB)
   ARB Hi-Lift Jack Mount
   Warn 9.5Ti Thermometric Self-Powered Winch
   Warn Receiver Shackle Bracket
   ARB 30,000 lb. Snatch Blocks—02ea.
   Crosby ¾” 4 ¾ Ton forged Bow Shackles—05ea.
   Pro-Comp 3”X30’ 30,000 lb. Recovery Strap
   20’ X 3/8 “ Grade 70 Transport Chain w/Eye Grab Hooks
   Comprehensive Tool Bag
   Safety Seal Off Road Tire Repair Kit
   D-handle Shovel
   3 ½ lb. Lumberjack Axe
   Small Bow Saw
   Coldfire 10# Class A/B/D Remote Fire Suppression System (engine compartment)
   FireAde 2000 A/B/D Fire Extinguishers—03ea.
   Kilby “AirBoss” York On-Board Air System (8+ cfm @ 150 psi)
   CoilHose 25’ Self-Storing Air Hose
   Advanced Air Systems Heavy-Duty Tire Inflator (0-60 psi)
   Coleman 450 watt Inverter
   Powerstation PS1100 Jump Starter/12v Power Supply
   20’ 4ga Booster Cables
   Adventure Medical Kits “Comprehensive” Medical Kit
   Quake Kare, Inc. 4-Person 3-Day Survival Kit
   WEDCO NATO Style 5 gal. Water Can—02ea.
   SuperPump Siphon Hose & Extension
INTERIOR/SECURITY
   Hardtop & Soft Top w/tinted windows and Full Doors
   Bestop Header Safari Bikini
   VDP Windstopper
   WeatherFlectors Window Wind Deflectors
   Tough Stuff Gear Netz Center Console & Door Nets
   Tough Stuff Gear Netz Glove Box & Dash Nets
   BCS F1 Beverage Containment System—02ea.
   Roll Cage Padding in Occupant Areas
   CoverKing Wetsuit Seat Covers
   3-way Switched 12v. Outlet
   Husky Floor Mats
   Viper Paging Auto Alarm
   Steel Horse Automotive Locking Hood Latches
   Tuffy Security Door Keeper Lock Set
COMMUNICATIONS/MAPPING
   Cobra 29 NW Classic CB Radio
   48” Firestik Antenna
   Cobra 38WXST Handheld 40-Channel CB Radio
   Cobra GMRS LI 6000-2 WX VP 2-Way Radios—02ea.
   Radio Shack pro-94 Dual Trunking 1000-Channel Handheld Scanner
   Garmin GPSMap 76cs w/Custom RAM-Mount
   Garmin SteetPilot C340 GPS

As for finding a good repair shop, when you do, stick to it and support it.  My main guys for handling stuff over my head are ALL J PRODUCTS (http://boulderbars.com/), in Big Bear, about 168 miles from me in San Diego.  Long drive but worth knowing the work is going to be done right.

[Paul]

IMHO the stock skid plates are better than nothing ... but barely! I replaced mine within a year with some ShrockWorks stuff that wasn't too expensive but many times more impressive.

The e-locking rear differential does work and is very effective. In the 25-30 trips I've taken with the club I've used it about 1000 feet worth of trail ... 50 and 75 feet at a time. It can be the difference from just walking right up a difficult spot and struggling time and time again to make it.

The downhill assist ... never used it on the trail - and I disconnected that switch from the dash and dropped in down inside after trying it a few times. I filled the hole with my winch control switch.

The hill assist start on the automatic is nice but using the second foot works too! It keeps the truck in place when you take your foot off the pedal for a few seconds.

Dead nutz stock off the showroom floor the Xterra will go anywhere a Jeep with $50,000 worth of custom parts does 99.9% of the time - that extra fifty large covers that last one tenth of one percent. Some people like that, others don't and who's to say who's wrong? Personally just California is a rather large place so once I see the 99.9% of the places I can go I'll start with that last one tenth of one percent ... others start there!

[Phall92139]

I absolutely agree with Paul.  I was surprised to see how comparable to the Jeep Wrangler Rubicon the Xterra Off Road actually was.  I may be able to squeeze a little more and turn just a bit tighter in my Rubicon but the X's longer wheelbase adds some stability I'm lacking and let's you haul more gear/people.  I'd also trade my in-line 4.0 for the beast in my Xterra in a heartbeat. Yet they each have a place on the trails and I for one don't hold one in higher regard than the other.  I believe in the adage, "It's not what you wheel but how you wheel it!"   Both can be left completely stock and provide tons of off road enjoyment or as in my case with my Rubi or as with some of the rigs here and on http://www.thenewgen.org you can dump as much money and build as extreme as you want.  To me, that's what's so cool about this sport; your rig is your rig and you build it any way you want.

[webbtrad]

I say that both the Down Hill and Hill Start features are nice toys; however, are not deal breakers for me. On the other hand, the locker is an essential feature. I see from Paul's post that he has used it very little, but I bet it was welcomed and a life saver when he needed it! Having grown up on a farm, I know how stuck any vehicle can get off-road. Equipment to keep "rollin'"  is the most important accessory.

On the topic of accessories what suggestions do you have for "airing up" on the trail i.e., what do you guys use to pump up those tires, and what air pressure do you use off road? Ummm, I do have teenage son and a foot pump!

Paul, you mentioned a winch. What are you using?

Thanks for all the tidbits of info.

Paul H

[Phall92139]

Airing down is one of the best things to do for added traction off road.  It is amazing what a bigger footprint can do.  However, bear in mind that when you let air out of your tires you also reduce ground clearance.  Also, sidewalls are more prone to puncture.  If you are running a "LT" type truck tire, I'd say you can safely air down anywhere from 20-12 psi without worry of popping a bead on your rims.  Exactly how much to air down depends on the terrain.

As for airing back up, I have an on-board air compressor (driven off my engine) on my Jeep, and use my original QuickAir II for the Xterra.  There are a bunch of capable air compressors on the market now.  Just stay away from anything that doesn't clamp directly to your battery and make sure the duty cycle is enough to air up all 4 tires.  The other option, if you have the room to haul it, is a CO² Tank.  Works real fast and can fill a lot of tire before needing to be refilled itself.

[XterracerX]

Welcome to the Xterra club Phil!

With all the mods you have and a long list of parts... care to post a picture of that beast? Pictures are worth a thousand words. 

[Phall92139]

Welcome to the Xterra club Phil!

With all the mods you have and a long list of parts... care to post a picture of that beast? Pictures are worth a thousand words. 

Don't want to hijack this thread but I did post a couple of poser shots in the post "Nissan Newbie" in the General Topic section.

BTW-thanks for the welcome!

[GUANO]

I don't see any jeep pictures on that thread!  I must be taking crazy pills!

[Paul]

I'm using a Mile Marker with integrated relay a SX12 rated at 12,000 pounds pull. I've used it exactly zero times to save myself. Wheeling with other folks the 265 horsepower of another truck is going to beat any winch ever made. Having it made running Death Valley, The Mojave Trail, and Bradshaw alone safer.

I have used it to pull the frame of an old minivan out of a gully locally just to test the thing out. The VSX12 has replaced it with a better remote controller with something called a MiFi Technology which gives a variable pull rate and feedback.

I don't think you can stuff a bigger winch inside the ShrockWorks bumper.

S 4X4 vs. Offroad model differences

(I did rotate the housing around so that the winch clutch is facing downwards into the hole provided)

[Phall92139]

I don't see any jeep pictures on that thread!  I must be taking crazy pills!

No, I'm the crazy one. I posted the pics on thenewx.org.  Here's the link:  http://www.thenewx.org/forum/showthread.php?t=27552